Life 07 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Fri Jun 18, 2010 7:01 am

How can we obtain real happiness that does not disappear?

Every living being craves for happiness. It does not long for misery.

Some desire the acquisition of riches, some believe that gold can make them happy. Some amass articles of luxury, some collect vehicles, but everyone is set upon obtaining things that one believes can give him/her joy.

But those who know wherefrom one can get happiness are very few in number. Pure happiness is of the nature where it appears to be poison in the beginning, but turns into nectar later.

This happiness is secured through the awareness of the Self using the preliminary control of the senses, control of emotions, etc. which has to be initially gone through, and appears hard and unpleasant.

It involves struggle and effort. So the reaction may be bitter. This type is Pure Happiness.

Source: radiosai.org
It's all about "how much you made when you were right" & "how little you lost when you were wrong"
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Fri Jun 18, 2010 7:47 pm

The very living spreads its perfume

Question: I would like to help you by doing propaganda for your teachings. Can you advise the best way?

Krishnamurti: To be a propagandist is to be a liar. (Laughter.) Don't laugh, Sirs. Because, propaganda is merely repetition, and repetition of a truth is a lie. When you repeat what you consider to be the truth, then it ceases to be the truth.

Say, for instance, you repeat the truth concerning man's relationship to property, the truth which you have not discovered for yourself; what value has it? Repetition has no value; it merely dulls the mind, and you can only repeat a lie.

You cannot repeat truth, because truth is never constant. Truth is a state of experiencing, and what you can repeat is a static state; therefore it is not the truth. Please do see the importance of this. We are so used to being propagandists, to reading newspapers, to telling others about everything.

The propagandist is a mere repeater, not a teller of truth; therefore, propaganda does infinite damage in the world. The lecturer who goes out doing propaganda for an idea is really a destroyer of thought, because he just repeats his own or somebody else's experience.

But truth cannot be repeated, truth must be experienced from moment to moment by each one. Now, with that understanding, what can you do to help this teaching, to further this teaching? All that you can do is to live it; however little you understand, however tiny a part, live it completely - not superficially, but deeply, fully, as vitally, as intrinsically, as enthusiastically as possible.

Then, like a flower in a garden, that very living spreads its perfume. You don't have to do propaganda for the jasmine. The jasmine itself does the propaganda; its beauty, its perfume, its loveliness, tells the story. When you have not that loveliness, that beauty, you do propaganda for it, but the moment you have understood a little, you talk about it, preach it, shout it; because of your own understanding, you help another to understand, and therefore understanding spreads more and more, it moves further and further afield.

Surely, that is the only way to do what you call `propaganda' - which is an ugly word. Sir, how does a new thought spread, a living thought, not a dead thought? Surely, not through propaganda. Systems spread through propaganda, but not a living thought.

A living thought is spread by a living person, one who lives that thought. Without living it, you cannot spread a living thought; but the moment you live it, you will see. It is like the bees coming to the flower. The flower need not do propaganda for its honey - the bees know it, they come because there is nectar.

But without that nectar, to do propaganda is to deceive people, to exploit people, to cause division among people, to create envy and antagonism. But if there is that nectar of understanding, however little, then it spreads like fire.

You know how honey is secured, how many journeys a bee makes from the beehive to the flower, how it collects honey a little at a time. Similarly, if there is nectar, if there is beauty, if there is understanding in our hearts, that itself will perform the miracle of completely revolutionizing the world.

- Bombay 10th Public Talk 14th March, 1948 Commentaries On Living

Source: jkrishnamurthi.com
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Fri Jun 18, 2010 9:54 pm

Meditation, prayers and freedom

The whole of the Orient is mesmerized by the word meditation, and in the Occident, the word prayer is of tremendous importance.

It is essential to find out whether the mind - which is so very complex, and then caught in a system of what is called meditation, or in a repetition of words, however ancient, however meaningful as prayer - whether the mind can actually know what meditation is, or what lies beyond the word prayer, and discover an actual state that is really silent.

It is only when the mind is silent that we can understand anything. If I want to understand somebody, my mind must be quiet, not chattering, not prejudiced, not having innumerable opinions and experiences, for they prevent the observation and the understanding.

One can see directly that it is only when the mind is very quiet that there is a possibility of clarity; and the whole purpose of meditation in the East is to bring about such a state of mind. That purpose is the controlling of thought - which is the same purpose in constantly repeating a prayer - so that in that quiet state one may hope to understand one's problems.

One has to understand these problems, one has to be free of the anxieties and fears which they entail, otherwise one cannot really be a human being, one is a tortured entity, and the tortured entity obviously cannot see anything serious very clearly.

Unless one lays the foundation - which is to be free from fear, free from sorrow, anxiety, and all the traps that consciously or unconsciously one lays for oneself - I do not see how it is possible for a mind to be actually quiet. This is one of the most difficult things to communicate, or even to talk about.

- Talks in Europe 1967 4th Public Talk Paris 27th April 1967 Collected Works Volume 4

Source: jkrishnamurthi.com
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Sat Jun 19, 2010 5:29 am

The mind is always seeking something

Question: I have listened to you for many years and I have become quite good at watching my our thoughts and being aware of every thing I do, but I have never touched the deep waters or experienced the transformation of which you speak. Why?

Krishnamurti: I think it is fairly clear why none of us do experience something beyond the mere watching. There may be rare moments of an emotional state in which we see, as it were, the clarity of the sky between clouds, but I do not mean anything of that kind. All such experiences are temporary and have very little significance.

The questioner wants to know why, after these many years of watching, he hasn't found the deep waters. Why should he find them? Do you understand? You think that by watching your own thoughts you are going to get a reward: if you do this, you will get that.

You are really not watching at all, because your mind is concerned with gaining a reward. You think that by watching, by being aware, you will be more loving, you will suffer less, be less irritable, get something beyond; so your watching is a process of buying.

With this coin you are buying that, which means that your watching is a process of choice; therefore it isn't watching, it isn't attention. To watch is to observe without choice, to see yourself as you are without any movement of desire to change, which is an extremely arduous thing to do; but that doesn't mean that you are going to remain in your present state.

You do not know what will happen if you see yourself as you are without wishing to bring about a change in that which you see. Do you understand? I am going to take an example and work it out, and you will see.

Let us say I am violent, as most people are. Our whole culture is violent; but I won't enter into the anatomy of violence now, because that is not the problem we are considering. I am violent, and I realize that I am violent.

What happens? My immediate response is that I must do something about it, is it not? I say I must become non-violent. That is what every religious teacher has told us for centuries: that if one is violent one must become non-violent.

So I practise, I do all the ideological things. But now I see how absurd that is, because the entity who observes violence and wishes to change it into non-violence, is still violent. So I am concerned, not with the expression of that entity, but with the entity himself.

You are following all this, I hope. Now, what is that entity who says, `I must not be violent'? Is that entity different from the violence he has observed? Are they two different states? Do you understand, sirs, or is this too abstract? It is near the end of the talk and probably you are a bit tired.

Surely, the violence and the entity who says, `I must change violence into non-violence', are both the same. To recognize that fact is to put an end to all conflict, is it not? There is no longer the conflict of trying to change, because I see that the very movement of the mind not to be violent is itself the outcome of violence.

So, the questioner wants to know why it is that he cannot go beyond all these superficial wrangles of the mind. For the simple reason that, consciously or unconsciously, the mind is always seeking something, and that very search brings violence, competition, the sense of utter dissatisfaction.

It is only when the mind is completely still that there is a possibility of touching the deep waters.

- Ojai 6th Public Talk 21st July 1955

Source: jkrishnamurthi.com
It's all about "how much you made when you were right" & "how little you lost when you were wrong"
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Sat Jun 19, 2010 9:01 am

Where is the real joy in life?

Involvement in objective pleasure leads ultimately to grief. So, you must direct yourself towards the right means to attain bliss.

Where can you gain bliss from? It is not inherent in external objects. Though external objects appear to bring pleasure, they bring in grief as well.

The Scriptures clarify the truth that you are the very embodiment of bliss. The scriptures clarify the truth and help everyone attain the highest wisdom.


Source: radiosai.org
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Sat Jun 19, 2010 2:50 pm

It is only the innocent mind that can be spontaneous

Questioner: Is spontaneous action right action?

Krishnamurti: Do you know how difficult it is to be really spontaneous? When we are so conditioned by society, when we live on memory, on the past, how can we possibly be spontaneous?

Surely, to do something spontaneously is to act without motive, without calculation, without any self-interested feeling.

It is not self-centred action. You just do it out of the fullness of your being. But to be really spontaneous requires stripping yourself completely of the past. It is only the innocent mind that can be spontaneous.

- Saanen 9th Public Talk 25th July 1963 Collected Works

Source: jkrishnamurthi.com
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Sun Jun 20, 2010 7:49 am

Why is it important to practice Unity in all beings at all times?

The Divine is above and beyond all the limits of time and space. For Him, all beings are equal.

The difference between man, beast, bird, worm, insect and even the Divine is but a difference of the 'vessel' . It is like the electric current that flows through various devices and expresses itself in many different functions. There is no distinction in the current; it is the same.

So too, the one single Divine activates every creature and gives rise to manifold consequences. The ignorant feel that all devices are distinct. The wise see only the one uniform current.

The Divine appreciates the consciousness of unity as the basic motive of all acts.

Source: radiosai.org
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Sun Jun 20, 2010 2:58 pm

An ugly thing cannot be made beautiful.

She was among a group of people who had come to discuss some serious matter. She must have come out of curiosity, or was brought along by a friend. Well dressed, she held herself with some dignity, and she evidently considered herself very good looking. She was completely self-conscious: conscious of her body, of her looks, of her hair and the impression she was making on others.

Her gestures were studied, and from time to time she took different attitudes which she must have thought out with great care. Her whole appearance had about it the air of a long cultivated pose into which she was determined to fit, whatever might happen.

The others began to talk of serious things, and during the whole hour or more she maintained her pose. One saw among all those serious and intent faces this self-conscious girl, trying to follow what was being said and to join in the discussion; but no words came out of her. She wanted to show that she too was aware of the problem that was being discussed; but there was bewilderment in her eyes, for she was incapable of taking part in the serious conversation.

One saw her quickly withdraw into herself, still maintaining the long-cultivated pose. All spontaneity was being sedulously destroyed. Each one cultivates a pose. There is the walk and the pose of a prosperous business man, the smile of one who has arrived; there is the look and the pose of an artist; there is the pose of a respectful disciple, and the pose of a disciplined ascetic.

Like that self-conscious girl, the so-called religious man assumes a pose, the pose of selfdiscipline which he has sedulously cultivated through denials and sacrifices. She sacrifices spontaneity for effect, and he immolates himself to achieve an end. Both are concerned with a result, though at different levels; and while his result may be considered socially more beneficial than hers, fundamentally they are similar, one is not superior to the other. Both are unintelligent, for both indicate pettiness of mind.

A petty mind is always petty; it cannot be made rich, abundant. Though such a mind may adorn itself or seek to acquire virtue, it remains what it is, a petty, shallow thing, and through so-called growth, experience, it can only be enriched in its own pettiness.

An ugly thing cannot be made beautiful. The god of a petty mind is a petty god. A shallow mind does not become fathomless by adorning itself with knowledge and clever phrases, by quoting words of wisdom, or by decorating its outward appearance.

Adornments, whether inward or outward, do not make a fathomless mind; and it is this fathomlessness of the mind that gives beauty, not the jewel or the acquired virtue. For beauty to come into being, the mind must be choicelessly aware of its own pettiness; there must be an awareness in which comparison has wholly ceased.

- . Krishnamurti Commentaries on Living Series I Chapter 53, Spontaneity

Source: jkrishnamurthi.com
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Mon Jun 21, 2010 6:40 am

When you love, you love, you do not ask.

Questioner: Sir, can love have an object?

Krishnamurti: Who is asking the question? Thought or love? Love is not asking this question. When you love, you love! - you do not ask, `Is there an object, or no object, is it personal or impersonal?'. Oh, you do not know what is means, the beauty of it!

Our love, as it is, is such a trial; our relationship with each other is such a conflict. Our love is based on your image of me and my image of you. Look at it very carefully, at the relationship between these two isolated images which say to each other, `We love'.

The images are the product of the past, of memories, memories of what you said to me and I said to you; and this relationship between the two images must inevitably be an isolating process. That is what we call relationship.

To be related means to be in contact not merely physically which is not possible when there is an image, when there is the self-isolating process of thought, which is the `me', and the`you'.

We say: `Has love an object? Or is love divine or profane?, - you follow? Sir, when you love, you are neither giving nor receiving.

- 6th Public Talk Saanen 28th July 1970

Source: jkrishnamurthi.com
It's all about "how much you made when you were right" & "how little you lost when you were wrong"
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Re: Life 7 (Apr 10 - Jun 10)

Postby winston » Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:15 am

What is the most difficult quest in the universe?

Even the boundless ocean can be drunk by one with ease. Huge mountains can be plucked from the face of the earth easily. The flames of a huge conflagration can be swallowed without any difficulty. But controlling the mind is far more difficult than all these.

Therefore, if one succeeds in overwhelming the mind, one achieves the awareness of the soul. This success can result only when one undergoes many ordeals and denials. The bliss that is the result of this effort is the highest kind of happiness.


Source: radiosai.org
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